New sanctuary small sound install question

[ashdixon]

I am not sure if this is posted under the right forum or not.
We currently use a really basic little lapel and wireless mic transmitter to furnish sound to a worship training area, and we have been recording mp3s using a little digital lecture type recorder that are edited and uploaded. My role in our church has been one of maintaining the website for both our church and school and recording/editing/uploading sermons online.
We have a new sanctuary that we are nearing completion on and I’ve been asked for input on sound equipment needs.


Basically, what is wanted is a sound system for 1) recording sermons, 2)bringing sound into a new cry room, and 3)incorporating an assisted hearing induction loop system for congregants in the worship service.
Plans are to mic the pulpit and invest in a wireless mic for use with things like communion or baptism.
Plans are to mic the organ as well and mix that into the cry room. In the future we may mic a piano as well.
That’s it.
Here’s a short list of equipment that I was thinking of using.
Audio Technica U857QL Microphone - pulpit
Line 6 XD-V70L Digital wireless system
Yamaha MG102C
Pyle Stereo Amp and Pyle-pro speakers
Zoom H2 Handy Portable Stereo Recorder (alt. - Tascam DR07 Portable Digital Recorder)
The induction loop system is either univox or ampetronic.
I don’t see the need for distributed sound for the worship training/cry room because of its proximity and it’s only one area that we’re piping sound.


My question is that I am wondering if there is anything I’m missing. Is the mixer/amp combo okay or overkill or is there a simpler solution? I would think that the little Yamaha mixer gives us some flexibility for our minimal needs. Would the pulpit mic be overkill for our needs? Same for the wireless?

Any thoughts or recommendations are appreciated.
Ash

[cw4u]

I would say do not purchase the pyle amp and speakers except for your cry room. I'm actually pretty happy with their in ceiling speakers and their amps aren't bad for in ceiling jobs. But no way would I use one for FOH duty.

If you give room specs, people will be able to better determine what type of speaker you need.

[Brad Weber]

Originally Posted by ashdixon

We have a new sanctuary that we are nearing completion on and I’ve been asked for input on sound equipment needs.

The audio system and acoustics should have been an integral part of the overall facility design, when that does not happen then the rest of the facility design, including any audio related power, conduit and wall/floor box provisions, may control what is possible or makes the most sense for the audio system.

Originally Posted by ashdixon

Basically, what is wanted is a sound system for 1) recording sermons, 2)bringing sound into a new cry room, and 3)incorporating an assisted hearing induction loop system for congregants in the worship service.

Originally Posted by ashdixon

I don’t see the need for distributed sound for the worship training/cry room because of its proximity and it’s only one area that we’re piping sound.

I'm not real clear about whether the Cry Room is to have sound or not or are there two Cry Rooms associated with different spaces? You also don't mention sound for the main worship space, so is this system just for recording and assistive listening?

On the equipment, how would the Zoom H2 be used? Has any design or planning been performed for the induction loop systems and has its installation been coordinated with other work and construction?

In general it would really help to know a bit more about your services, the new space, your budget and so forth.

[ashdixon]

Thanks for the replies.

@cw4u -

I would say do not purchase the pyle amp and speakers except for your cry room. I'm actually pretty happy with their in ceiling speakers and their amps aren't bad for in ceiling jobs. But no way would I use one for FOH duty.

If you give room specs, people will be able to better determine what type of speaker you need.

I could not find the pics of the elevation drawings but here are a few photos to give a better idea.
There is only one cry room in the back with two viewing windows. I guesstimate it to be about 12' or 14'x10' or so w/8' ceiling.

So, you think the Pyle stuff would work in the cry room area - with the above dimensions and photo - any other thoughts?

@BW
The capacity for this sanctuary is somewhere around 200-220. I don't have the dimensions off hand. The loft is for choir/organ. Ceilings are like 30' high at peak.
This is a concrete form design structure.
I believe acoustics were taken into account with the design - there will be no powered sound into the worship space itself. Our purposes for mic'ing the pulpit and organ are to provide sound to the cry room and having the area set up for assisted hearing.
There's conduit from pulpit to sound equipment closet area. The pulpit is going to be about 3' higher than the current risers in the photo. it'll be black walnut and fixed/stationary.
The flooring will be tiled in the worship area/ carpeting in cry room (I think)and the induction loop wiring will be laid prior to the tile.
So, aside from bringing sound into the cry room this system is just for recording sermons and assisted hearing.
The Zoom H2 would be connected to an out on the mixer. I thought of using a rack mounted digital recorder - with either device the recording quality would be the same.
As for budget - an upper limit of $3000 is about it.

Thanks again for any shared wisdom.
Ash

[Brad Weber]

Ash-

Thanks, your response really helped. One of the reasons I asked about the Zoom H2 was that you mentioned want to mic the organ and I didn't see anything for that so I thought maybe you were using the H2 as a microphone. If you are not then do you also need some type of ambient or hanging mic?

I personally would have two concerns with using the H2. One is that the line in audio connection is a TRS 1/8" jack and while being unbalanced may be acceptable due to the short distance involved, the connection would likely be exposed since you need to see the H2 screen and access the SD card and thus I can see it potentially becoming dislodged or damaged. The other concern is the chances of the device either walking away or being somewhere else when you need it. If the intent is to be able to record the service and then take the H2 with you or to also use it other places, where it would often be removed then these issues might be more of a consideration.

On the induction loop, my concern was getting the connectivity from the amplifier to the coax or ribbon cable antenna in the floor. You might also want to verify running the cable under the tile floor planned, it might be fine but if the tile will be laid on a grout bed then I'm not sure that the flat ribbon cable type antennas are recommended for that and the direct burial coax cable antennas that are designed to be installed in concrete might be so thick as to be a concern. The manufacturer of the IL system should be able to help you determine what is the best approach for you.

Pyle offers a number of speakers and amplifiers, did you have any particular ones in mind?

[ashdixon]

Thanks Brad,

Yes, I do need to add a microphone for the organ, though I may be able to feed a straight line signal. If not, though, I have not yet picked out a mic for that purpose.
I see your concerns about using the Zoom. I could go with a rack-mounted.
B & H has these - (I can't post external links yet)
Technical Pro U-REC5 Rackmount USB/SD Digital Audio Recorder
Ikey Audio RM3 Rackmount Digital Audio Recorder

For the Pyle equipment I was thinking of these:
Pyle-Pro PT1100 Power Amplifier
Pyle-Pro PIC6E 6.5" 250W In-Ceiling Speaker System (Pair)

I can't post links cause I'm a new member, but I appreciate your taking the time to look and offer input.
Ash

[cw4u]

I would look at the PDPC8T. Having the backcans installed will give you a much nicer sound.