Fire Alarm Mute Speakers

[byronyasgur]

Originally Posted by bladeaudio

Powering down the system (in this case your powered mixer) is no harder on your speakers then...... powering down your system, which you do every night before you go home. Take a look at the furman product I recommended above.

i had thought that the switch on the back of the unit would have incorporated some electronics ( i imagined a capacitor or resistor arrangement or something ) that would make the power off more of a soft landing than a hard landing for the amps - are you saying that literally yanking the power is the exact same thing as hitting the off switch - here's our mixer -( yamaha emx 5016cf ) sorry cant link

ps thanks for other replies too

[waynehoskins]

Originally Posted by byronyasgur

are you saying that literally yanking the power is the exact same thing as hitting the off switch

Bingo. Virtually everything simply has the power switch in line with the AC. Pull the plug, push the switch, same thing.

[bladeaudio]

This is a very common way of powering down a sound system, through the power.

[tedanderson]

We are moving into a new building and our electrician just contacted me to ask me about the fire specification which says we have to mute the speakers automatically if the fire goes off ( to allow people to hear the alarm ) ...

First and foremost, check with the inspector. Your electrician is smart in pointing that out but seeking an answer from the inspector is the wiser thing to do. We were advised that the installation of the strobes in our sanctuary (per ADA requirements) covered that possibility. He also suggested that while integrating the fire alarm into other building related systems is a good thing to do, it makes the fire alarm more prone to failures and false alarms.

[Brad Weber]

Originally Posted by tedanderson

First and foremost, check with the inspector. Your electrician is smart in pointing that out but seeking an answer from the inspector is the wiser thing to do. We were advised that the installation of the strobes in our sanctuary (per ADA requirements) covered that possibility.

I certainly agree that it is the interpretation of the AHJ (Authority Having Jurisdiction) that matters and the size and rated occupancy of the space may be factors in what is required, however if aural annunciation and/or voice evacuation are required then I am not sure how having strobes for visual annunciation would negate that, it's usally an additive situation and not one or the other.

Originally Posted by tedanderson

He also suggested that while integrating the fire alarm into other building related systems is a good thing to do, it makes the fire alarm more prone to failures and false alarms.

We are not discussing anything that triggers or controls the life safety system, rather the life safety system triggering another system. The life safety system likely already provides the related contact closure or control voltage output even if there is nothing connected to it and while I can see the methods presented possibly making the audio system subject to potentially being turned off or muted due to false alarms, I don't see how it could cause the life safety system to false alarm or fail. Maybe there was some misunderstanding regarding how this would be implemented.

[Les]

Originally Posted by Brad Weber

I certainly agree that it is the interpretation of the AHJ (Authority Having Jurisdiction) that matters and the size and rated occupancy of the space may be factors in what is required, however if aural annunciation and/or voice evacuation are required then I am not sure how having strobes for visual annunciation would negate that, it's usally an additive situation and not one or the other.

Brad,

I think you just help reinforce Ted's point...

You, Brad Weber, are not sure how strobes would meet the auditory requirement, but the AHJ obviously allowed it and deemed it to meet the requirements that were set forth. Maybe through an exemption or a different interpretation, etc. The point is, it was allowed.

So, Ted's advice is wise.

We could tell you all day long what is or isn't required but the bottom line comes down to the AHJ and what they require. Maybe they will issue a waiver or exemption on a certain requirement, or allow something else to be substituted.

Then again, you could do everything by the book and they could still require something else.

Remember, right or wrong, someone has to sign your Occupancy Certificate before you can move in (at least here) so it's best to consult with them directly.

Sidenote: It's odd and funny to me that a requirement can be exempted or changed and yet I've experienced that recently on several occasions.... Maybe it should always read Required! (Unless we say it isn't).

[Brad Weber]

Originally Posted by Les

You, Brad Weber, are not sure how strobes would meet the auditory requirement, but the AHJ obviously allowed it and deemed it to meet the requirements that were set forth. Maybe through an exemption or a different interpretation, etc. The point is, it was allowed.

My point was really that there quite likely were multiple factors involved in Ted's specific situation and that assuming why something was accepted or that the interpretation in that specific case would also apply to others should be avoided when addressing life safety. I'm dealing with a situation in another forum where someone brought up an exemption they managed to obtain in their situation and now several others seem to be assuming they'll be able get the same exemption when I seriously doubt many, if any, of them have the exact same situation or will actually get that exemption.

Originally Posted by Les

Sidenote: It's odd and funny to me that a requirement can be exempted or changed and yet I've experienced that recently on several occasions.... Maybe it should always read Required! (Unless we say it isn't).

Quite true and if an AHJ provides an interpretation or exemption you should be sure to get it in writing, not only may it be someone else inspecting the next time but "they said it was okay" is not a very strong defense if there ever is a related problem.

[byronyasgur]

not that i mind this discussion going on on my thread or anything but to be honest i dont really follow what;s going on and am a bit too busy to get into the nitty gritty though i'm sure it's quite important - anyway i thought i'd just address the initial comment in this section to say that the electrician was quoting the fire officers requirements when he told me about the audio mute - it's the fire officer's stipulation not the electrician's suggestion

[dmot]

I don't know about electrical exemptions but I do know that some laws have a stipulation that leaves room for better alternatives. In those cases an exemption is given only if it leads to a better solution. Exemptions are given if doing so provides for a safer or cleaner (a lot of water pollution law) system but rarely given for a system that would be less safe/clean.

[tedanderson]

Originally Posted by Brad Weber

We are not discussing anything that triggers or controls the life safety system, rather the life safety system triggering another system. The life safety system likely already provides the related contact closure or control voltage output even if there is nothing connected to it and while I can see the methods presented possibly making the audio system subject to potentially being turned off or muted due to false alarms, I don't see how it could cause the life safety system to false alarm or fail. Maybe there was some misunderstanding regarding how this would be implemented.

You and I know that, but what the inspector says/thinks is really what matters. If he says, "Don't do _______ and I'll sign off on your CO" even though it might not have a single thing to do with which way the wind blows, we'll do it.

[byronyasgur]

right enough of this i'm unsubscribing none of this is remotely relevant to me - if anyone wants to say anything important to me pm me please - thanks for the initial couple of comments which actually answered the question - ahem

[Brad Weber]

Originally Posted by byronyasgur

right enough of this i'm unsubscribing none of this is remotely relevant to me - if anyone wants to say anything important to me pm me please - thanks for the initial couple of comments which actually answered the question - ahem

I'm not sure why, but in just the last week this has come up in three different forums in which I participate. Most forums are a community and the intent of the forum is to serve both individual members and the larger community in general. As a result, forum discussions often address more than the initial specific issue in order to potentially benefit the larger forum community. That is the nature of forums and when getting free help one must often take what is offered. In addition, while some information presented may not seem directly relevant now, who knows if it may become relevant at some point in the future or if it may sometime allow you to help someone else.