Real newbie question/analog sound board

[GeneN]

Hi all, I know something about computers, little about sound SO when our church decided to record sermons I volunteered.....I can hear the groans now....

Sound board is 8 year old Peavey RQ4324C analog. Not using any compressors, sound for praise and worship and sermon actually pretty good. BUT pastors voice will sometimes get very loud during sermon. So to avoid clipping record volume cannot be too high...you know the story....Our sound guys have very little training, do well with what they know but give me a blank look when I ask about compressors.

My idiot question: How do you use the compressors? Here is a link to the manual

(I cannot post link because I do not have 15 or more posts. Go to Peavey.com, support, archived manuals, then RQ4300. Sorry)

Looks like you have to patch between jacks? If input is wireless mike on channel 8, could someone suggest actual connections? And would this leave house sound intact?

Thanks so much! Gene

[tdangelo]

Gene,
I went to Peavey’s website and tried to look up that model but didn’t see it. Sorry. So, in general terms. There are in a general sense really only three ways to hook up an outboard analog compressor:

One is upstream of the audio console.
Two is inserted into the audio console.
Three is downstream of the audio console.

If upstream of the audio console the input signal from the mic is plugged directly into the compressor and the output of the compressor will go into the input of the audio console. Care must be taken that the compressor can take a mic level signal OR the mic must be pre-amped before going into the compressor. Also, care must be taken that the output of the compressor is compatible in signal strength to the input of the audio console. This method will add the compression effect to all destinations that microphone is sent to. No other microphones will have the benefit or effect of the compressor. The recording and the PA speakers will be compressed for that mic/input signal.

If inserted into the audio console (assuming the console has input or subgroup inserts) the input signal from the mic is plugged directly into the audio console. The compressor is patched in and out of the insert jack on the console’s input, or sub group. This method will add the compression effect to all destinations the console input or sub group is sent to. If the compressor is patched to an input channel no other microphone input channels will have the benefit or effect of the compressor. If the compressor is patched to a sub group, all other microphones input channels assigned to that sub group will have the benefit or effect of the compressor. The recording and the PA speakers will be compressed for that mic/input signal. The recording and the PA speakers will be compressed for that sub group IF that subgroup is also feeding PA.


If downstream of the audio console the input signal from the mic is plugged directly into the audio console, the output of the audio console will plug into the input on the compressor and the output of the compressor will go to your recording device. Care must be taken that the compressor can take a line level signal. Also, care must be taken that the output of the compressor is compatible in signal strength to the input of the audio recorder. This method will add the compression effect to all sources being recorded. Compression will not be heard in the PA speakers.

[GeneN]

Hi Tom, thanks so much for the detailed and thoughtful reply. Option #3 is what I would like, do not want to mess up what works already for house sound.

If I could impose on you further, please try the Peavey site again. Select support, then Owners manual/operating guides. Then (heres where I messed up the first few times) under the search button select blue print "Search Archived Owners Manuals". Then select the letter R, then RQ4300.

Essentially I think this board has "external compressors" packaged in the same housing as the rest of the board. As basic as it sounds, what I really need is to know what jacks to use.

Thanks for your patience. Gene

[Brad Weber]

Here's the manual, http://www.peavey.com/assets/literat...s/80304789.pdf. The compressors are normally part of the four Group signal chains right before the Group faders, but they can be individually patched in to individual channel inserts via TRS cables or patched on aux or main outputs or used much like an external device, although as unbalanced audio. There is a switch in the compressor controls that determines if each compressor is assigned to the related Group or used as a separate 'external' device.

It should be noted is that the compressors are fixed at a 4:1 compression ratio and have fixed attack and release, only the threshold and output gain are adjustable. That makes them a bit less flexible than most compressors.

The challenge you are likely to encounter is that is you insert a compressor on the overall recording mix then it will affect the entire mix and not just the Pastor. It may be the Pastor's level that causes the compression but it may apply to the entire signal.

So probably the first question would be if you use Groups and if so, whether you use the compressor for those groups? The next question would be how you record and in particular, what outputs on the console you use?

[GeneN]

Hi Brad, thanks for the reply, and for posting the link. Yesterday you also replied to my post in "Audio recording".

As I have said (but no one believes me!!!!) I have little sound knowledge. The sound board people do not seem have a good grasp of the sound board, either. We have no groups set up, everything is single channel. Sound board people are very good at adjusting input levels etc. So "If it aint broke don't fix it". I do not want to step on toes,or confuse people. I'd like to leave house sound, especially praise and worship, alone.

I have been recording sermons to a PC with Audacity. Pastors voice may be soft or VERY loud during sermons, hence interest in compressor. I have been using headphone jack to SoundBlaster SB1090 to USB. Overall sound quality of recording surprisingly good, but overall volume low. I have headphone jack volume control as high as it will go without clipping.

If pastors wireless mike, not used during praise and worship, is channel 8, could I patch from "Insert" on channel 8 to "Compressor 1 I/O" ? Then compressor 1 would only control channel 8. I would still record from headphone jack. Would affect house sound during sermon. Yes? No?

Thanks again, wonderful group on this forum. God bless. Gene

[GeneN]

Or should I just be looking at purchasing an external compressor to use downstream from headphone jack? Can this be combined with USB audio card function? Any recommendations? Thanks again. Gene

[prochlea]

I took a look at the manual, and it looks like you can patch in those compressors if you use a standard TRS cable to connect it to the insert jack on the channel you want. Normally the compressor is compressing it's particular subgroup.

The compressors are on the jacks labeled "Comp (1-4) I/O" and then you have to press the button on the compressor strip to switch it from Subgroup to External. Or - if you just want to compress it for the recording, which might actually be better - you can route the pastor through one of the subgroups and take the subgroup direct out to the recorder. Then you don't have to patch in the compressor.

[tdangelo]

It appears that the console has four channels of patchable compression built in. If this is true you can wire it as so:

[tdangelo]

If using an external compressor, typical wiring would be:

[tdangelo]

Or patched to the mains:

[bpalermini]

If your sound guys aren't using the groups anyway why no just assign the pastor's mic to a group, use that group's compressor and use the group output to feed your computer.

No extra cables required. Just move from the 1/4" headphone output to the 1/4" group output.

You said you don't want to mess with what is working for the house sound so you don't want to insert the compressor to the input channel. That would also impact the house sound.

[GeneN]

WOW!! Thanks to Brad, Bob, Tom, and Pat. Not only do I have an approach to handle this, but I have a much better idea of how sound boards work. Thanks so much!

I think I will ask the pastor if he wants his voice to continue to have the potential to be very loud in house. I suspect he will say yes. If so, I will just deal with the recording output. May try to set up a compressor group with just his mike, as Bob suggested. Pat, your diagrams were great, a lot clicked into focus as soon as I saw them.

In any case, at the beginning I will probably record to 2 PCs, 1 the backup current system, the second thru compressor.

Thanks again and God blesss. Gene