Crest quality?

[Jay M]

I'm looking to replace two mixers that have let me down. I need something well built, and that won't degrade over time.

One is for our recording studio where we record the spots for the radio broadcast, the the other is for the church where we record the sermons.

I currently have a Mackie Onyx 16 channel board in both places, and both are not working properly.

The Crest X 18R will work well, but I don't know about their quality. Money isn't really an issue as long as build quality can justify the price. I'd rahter pay $3000 for a mixer that will perform flawlessly for ten years than pay $1200 one that will be flaky for a few years and eventually need to be replaced anyway.

Are there any other mixers you could recommend? The one for the church must be rack mountable, the one for the studio can be tabletop.

thanks,
~Jay

[pdc]

Crest is Peavey now. It has been for a while. The men behind Crest started their own company, making only consoles. Their consoles have a good reputation. Pre Peavey large format consoles can be a great find. Consoles like the V12 were built to be Yamaha PM4000 killers, and far exceeded that goal. They sound great.

The new mixers do not hold up so well. They cheaped out on faders and pots. The circuitry is fine. That line was designed by the Crest guys before they all split. The comparable, more robust, truly pro mixers can be found here:

http://www.apb-dynasonics.com/produc...s_Spectra.html

You will not be unhappy with these guys and their consoles.

[Jay M]

Thanks, that is exactly the kind of info I need.

~Jay

[STEALMYBUCKS]

Also, hammer Mackie! Let them know their equipment is letting you down, you would be surprised at their response when you let them know what is going on. It may not be the long term replacement you are looking for, but let Mackie have a shot at fixing their products. I know a few of their engineers (they bought a truck from my dad), they always want feedback on their gear.

For the church I would say go digital. Scene recall is amazing and is a must feature if you have multiple services. We have three rehearsals a week, and three different services, Celebrate Recovery, Youth, and Sundays. We have an LS9, and I have set up the udk to do scene recall, making rehearsals easy and services exactly the same as the rehearsals.

[Jay M]

I actually did let them fix it once. That took two weeks. Now it's broken again. Mackie gear is designed to be cheap so it can compete with Behringer. We can't afford downtime.

The APB stuff looks really good, and it's not really that expensive. I had a nice talk with "P" of APB today. I like a company that takes pride in their product, and has proper support.

I used to have a digital mixer for recording, it turned out to be a nightmare for volunteers to use. Granted digital has come a long way since then, but for what we do there is no need. I just need a good, clean analog signal. All the processing is done later.

For front of house, I think digital would be ideal. But for recording, I prefer simple, durable, and clean.

My dream would be if someone could design a full bandwidth digital wireless UHF system with a world class mic pre, and digital output. Then I could just record the mic digitally. I don't think such a thing exists yet.

I wonder if I get get the pastor to wear a Sound Devices recorder over shoulder while he preaches

~Jay

[cmchamp]

Jay
I too have been impressed with the APB products. I had signed up as a Crest dealer right after the Peavey buy-out, but before they announced to anyone. I'm still a Crest dealer/contractor, but luckily, the contract I signed under requires no annual minimum.

Top notch analog consoles are getting harder to come buy.
As for Crest's XR series, traveling quartet groups that are utilizing them, in both FOH and the monitor model, love them and they've been rock solid, even when traveling in bus cargo bins.

Here's another option that may be similar quality to the APB: http://www.toftaudiodesigns.com/

C.

[Brad Weber]

I think you'll find almost unanimously positive reviews and comments on APB-Dynasonics products and not just regarding the product quality but also in terms of their focus on functionality and ease of use and in regards to the support.

[pdc]

[quote=STEALMYBUCKS;309613
For the church I would say go digital. Scene recall is amazing and is a must feature if you have multiple services. We have three rehearsals a week, and three different services, Celebrate Recovery, Youth, and Sundays. We have an LS9, and I have set up the udk to do scene recall, making rehearsals easy and services exactly the same as the rehearsals.[/QUOTE]

While digital is convenient, it has it's issues. The recall is nice, but not all digital consoles have it, and the recalls are only as good as the reset of the stage, ability for people to be in the right place at the right time, with their vocals and instruments consistent with the time the scene was first set. Since stuff happens and things always change, I would think of the scene as a good rough mix to start with. That said, in some smaller churches, I know of people who really know their gear and their people, and can rough in a mix, if not have it darn near spot on with analog gear. So, this is all relative.

Now, as far as sound quality goes, an average analog console will stomp a budget digital console into the ground. As for longevity, digital consoles have yet to be proven any more or less reliable than analog. The good thing about an analog console is that it will die gracefully. You can lose a channel and keep on going. When a digital console reboots, dies, etc, the show stops.

[Frank DeWitt]

The usefulness of scenes on a good mixer is hard to over state. I use them continuously. They are not just something I setup during practice and leave alone. I set them up in practice and recall them at the last practice just before the service. they are a starting point. I adjust for what is new that morning. Mark is absent, Jim has taken his place. Enter Jim's name on the electronic scribble strip so I will remember it. Sandra is getting a cold and needs a bit of EQ and more gain, OK now update the scene. OK now there is a solo for special music with piano backup. The pianist wants a click track from the video they are accompanying in her IEM, (usually she has her mix of the WT) They practice, I set it up, Type in a name and save it. Now I am ready for the service in 10 min.

Dunning the service I use preset scenes for pastor, pulpit, CD, Video, ETC. It is just a quick way to mute all mics except the ones I want.

During the first Worship Team song, of course there are tweaks to the scene. The room is full of people and the WT has more energy. Near the end of the song I update the scene. Why? Because the pastor may stand up to say something. Hit his scene, when he is through, hit WT and they are back.

In short, I don't depend on them being "right" from week to week, but they are a very handy starting point and group mute. I don't use them like you would in a scripted play. I recall them with hot keys or a mouse as needed.

All this depends on a board that allows easy scene input, recall, and instant changes. Mine uses a standard keyboard for input, and hot keys for scene recall along with a menu of all scenes that is always visible.

As for digital quality. We replaced a 14 year old Tascam large format mixer with digital and I received a number of comments that the sound was better with words like "cleaner" There have been no negative comments. The WT says the signal in there IEMs is cleaner and has a lower noise floor. Reliability is addressed by modular components. If a preamp or fader pack go down I still have a mixer. We have a backup engine.

Frank

[stevelam]

Corey you are the MAN!!! I have been looking for an analog mixer with a built in meter bridge for so long. A customer ordered a Live 8 from me and it has been on backorder forever. This is a lot more but I think he will take it.

So thanks for indirectly answering my question lol

[cmchamp]

You're welcome Steve.

[Jay M]

The 8 Channel Toft ATB-08, might work well in our studio. I'll have to look at the price... MSRP is kind of high for only 8 channels.

~Jay