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  #25 (permalink)  
Old Saturday, April 21st, 2007, 07:52 AM
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another option

go to http://www.clearsonic.com/ They make excellent drum booths. my old church has purchased 2 of them and they REALLY make a difference. If your drummer is on some sort of in ear monitoring then they will love it as well. They are not cheap but they really are well made and work quite well.

Shannon
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old Sunday, July 13th, 2008, 09:35 AM
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Gracetech - I wanted to get a better look at the hinge section to see how you got the sections to come together. I was also thinking about making it a little hardier (like TMcKeller) than the 1x3 so I can put a short plexi wall on top of the duct board wall. Something like using 2x4's instead of 1x3's, putting a masonite sheet in the middle with duct board towards the drums and some canvas covered material towards the audience - that way it will have some added sound stoppage for the drums, added sound deadening on stage (which we need badly) and maybe appease the appearance police - all in one.

Thanks
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old Sunday, July 13th, 2008, 10:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rythym4God View Post
go to http://www.clearsonic.com/ They make excellent drum booths. my old church has purchased 2 of them and they REALLY make a difference. If your drummer is on some sort of in ear monitoring then they will love it as well. They are not cheap but they really are well made and work quite well.

Shannon
These are what we use. I do disagree on them not being cheap though. Go and compare some other kits that have comparable features. Clear Sonic is more than fair in their pricing.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old Sunday, July 13th, 2008, 12:03 PM
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We use one for our youth group as well. But the guy couldn't stand having the acoustic paneling over his head, so we took it off.

I loved it when that paneling was on, because I could control the mix a whole lot better. Now, the drums just overpowper everything.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old Monday, July 14th, 2008, 05:54 AM
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clearsonic

I used the clearsonic version at the circus church I was at and yes, it did work fine - and we used their sound dampening panels as well. However, this is in a more permanent installation. I saw what Gracetech built and I would like to mimic that. I also may use the same type of construction for some sound dampening for the 2 drumsets in my basement
Thanks
rm
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old Monday, July 14th, 2008, 07:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TMoT111 View Post

Will the 1" be sufficient? The data sheet from owens-corning says the 1" has an NRC of 0.7 , (0.08 at 125Hz, 0.19 at 250, and 0.69 at 600) compared to 1.0 and 0.14, 0.72, and 1.15 for the 2". (http://www.owenscorning.com/comminsu...EnduraGold.pdf). That's the data, what does it mean??
inch or so off the backing?
A 1.0 rating roughly corresponds to 20 dB absorption. So as you can see this stuff is only sucking out the highs and leaves the lows unaffected. Now you have a tubby sounding drum set.

The only way to really control things is to build an enclosed drum booth. Now if you're gonna play drums inside an isolated room you might as well get used to playing V-drums. Besides ... they sound a lot better in a good PA system than "real" drums anyway.
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  #31 (permalink)  
Old Monday, July 14th, 2008, 10:14 AM
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There may be some of the common confusion of sound absorption and sound isolation going on here. NRC or absorption coefficient ratings relate to sound absorption and have no real relation to sound transmission. The primary goal of any isolation booth is typically sound isolation, wanting to limit sound transmission of sound from the source to receivers. That is usually achieved by dense solids and impedance mismatches. For drum booths that is typically plexi vision panels or other dense materials. Materials like ductboard provide very little sound isolation and what little isolation they do provide is almost solely at high frequencies.

However, once you surround a drummer or vocalist with such sound isolating panels then you create their own little acoustical environment which typically requires sound absorption to control. This is why you often want sound absorbing materials on the inside of the enclosure and although it can help with the resulting reduction in sound, it has much more to do with what the drummer hears or what mics pickup than it does with the actual isolation provided by the booth.

An often forgotten aspect is the wall behind the drummer. If it is a reflective surface not only may it reduce the effectiveness of a drum shield due to sound reflecting off the wall and back out of the enclosure, but it may also be problems for the drummer and drum mics since all that contained energy may be reflecting off that surface.

Along with Clearsonic, Perdue Acoustics also offers some nice drum booth kits, http://www.perdueacoustics.com/drum_booth_kit.html.

FWIW, the shaped surface of some foam absorption products is not to provide diffusion, it is too small a physical dimension to be effective at low frequencies and the product is supposedly absorbing the higher frequencies, it is actually intended to increase the surface area of the material and make the surfaces coincident to a wider range of angles. Not only is the overall surface area greater but sounds coming from off axis see a much larger surface and it greatly improves the effectiveness at grazing angles.
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  #32 (permalink)  
Old Monday, July 14th, 2008, 03:38 PM
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I once went to a church where drum shields (plexi) didn't do rnough, so it was suggested that the drummer, that just couldn't hold back his volume, play from another room back stage and be connected witha video monitor and headphones so that he could play at the level he felt lead to play at. We finally had control of the drum volime in the Sanctuary, but at what price?
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  #33 (permalink)  
Old Monday, July 14th, 2008, 10:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhmusique View Post
Gracetech - I wanted to get a better look at the hinge section to see how you got the sections to come together.
Ask and ye shall receive.


Quote:
Originally Posted by rhmusique View Post
I was also thinking about making it a little hardier (like TMcKeller) than the 1x3 so I can put a short plexi wall on top of the duct board wall. Something like using 2x4's instead of 1x3's, putting a masonite sheet in the middle with duct board towards the drums and some canvas covered material towards the audience - that way it will have some added sound stoppage for the drums, added sound deadening on stage (which we need badly) and maybe appease the appearance police - all in one.
I often do this myself depending on the level of reduction but you will find that if you build it correctly you will not need 2X4's to make it rigid. When you add the masonite to the 1X3's it makes the unit even more rigid and it can easily handle any weight you put on it. If you use 2X4's you will make the unit way to heavy to move around easily. Of course if you are not moving it around much then you can feel free to weigh it down however you want. Also don't be afraid to use 1X4's and double up on the fiberboard. I don't have a cookie cutter way of doing things i just build to suit, if others can use a design i come up with i think that's fabulous but don't be afraid to experiment.

This particular shield i designed was meant to be light weight and fold to a minimum size. The attenuation purpose was to just bring the level of the kick snare and toms down to a manageable level. I have taken this design to the extreme by making a roll around drum room for churches that are portable and have highly reflective acoustics. I'm happy to walk you through and help you design a solution for your needs.

crt
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  #34 (permalink)  
Old Wednesday, July 23rd, 2008, 02:05 PM
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As for V-drums or putting a person in another room - I guess you could go that route. However, I have never been satisfied playing an electric set - from the early Tama's and Synares to the latest V-drums. Soundtechs may like them, pastors and parishoners may like them, but I have found few players who said that was their first choice. The mostly go that route b/c it is more acceptable to have a drumset with a volume knob than "real" drums.
I prefer the feel of really hitting something and the result of that being a natural tone or sound. The main problem with that natural or real sound is that the building or the environment was usually not built to deal with it. And then we ask a drummer/musician/artist to play less, to feel less, to give less.
Nope, I want the folks who are leading us in worship to be able to give their all, and their best (which does not necessarily equate loudest...) and at the same time not get in the way of people being moved b/c of the volume or the echo, etc.
Off track of the drum enclosure, but I still like the idea. If this works well, we will probably build a few dog house's to put the tube amps in, b/c there again, some amps sound better with lots of current flowing thru them, and no matter what your Line 6 store says, the only thing that REALLY sounds like an AC30 - is an AC30.
(ok, I will get off my soap box now)
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  #35 (permalink)  
Old Thursday, July 24th, 2008, 10:07 AM
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we have a built in nook very similar to crt's photos where the piano used to sit. we moved it and put the drums there several mths ago. it helps, but there is still more drum than we need in the room. i've been considering coming on up higher with plexiglass.
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  #36 (permalink)  
Old Thursday, July 24th, 2008, 12:13 PM
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I have to tell people that come in all the time and see how my solution works for my church that it has to be customized to each situation. I only need a little help in taking the power out of the drums so i settled for a half shield with light absorption. In some situations that works well but in more reverberant spaces it might need heave absorption and full shield to work well. Take an idea and make it fit your situation, that's what it's all about.

As for electronic drums i feel your pain. I get annoyed by electronic drums from both a engineer perspective and also a drummer perspective. I do realize that their are situations where electronic drums come in handy but i will always prefer acoustical drums.

crt
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